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Discussion on: Discuss: package sabotage

olyno profile image
Olyno

Russia has no legitimate reason to do so

Wrong. Russia has many reasons to invade Ukraine, including the minsk treaty: Ukraine is supposed to be a neutral country, and according to the minsk agreement, they are not allowed to join NATO. They have made the request.

I am against this invasion, but it is time to be objective in history and stop with this Ukrainian propaganda. Ukraine is not all white either. I'm the first one to be saddened by what's going on, but is it a good enough reason to screw up open source projects by adding a "glory to Ukraine" button to access to the app for example?

We now live in a world where everyone has to choose sides, and neutrality no longer counts. I see every day new open source projects choosing the side of Ukraine.

Please know that I am and will remain neutral in this story, I don't think it's fair to punish the Russian population for acts they didn't commit. Only the Russian government should receive the sanctions, not a whole country.

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darkwiiplayer profile image
π’Š©Wii πŸ’–πŸ’›πŸ’šπŸ’™πŸ’œπŸ’πŸ’Ÿ

I strongly disagree. Russia has absolutely no reason to invade Ukraine. None. They can cry all they want, but they will still be the only ones to blame. Every single reason Russia claims to have is either a complete fabrication or high-level crybully tactics. If Ukraine wants to join NATO, that's their decision alone, and in no way does it legitimise any action from the Russian side, let alone a war.

People just need to stop seeing nuances where there aren't any. Sometimes, although rarely, things just are black and white. This is one such case.

Ukrainian propaganda.

Unless Ukraine completely fabricated the whole invasion, I have no clue what propaganda you're talking about.

I don't think it's fair to punish the Russian population for acts they didn't commit.

There's a point when inaction isn't neutral. Walking past a drowning child with a shrug isn't neutral, and neither is the acceptance of the Russian population towards this war.

We now live in a world where everyone has to choose sides, and neutrality no longer counts.

Absolutely not. Not the rest of the world, who isn't responsible for this war. I don't think we should attack those who do pick a side in the form of cyber activism, but I won't blame anybody who doesn't want that. This, however, is not the case for people who, directly or indirectly, support this invasion simply by remaining inactive. They are picking a side by default.

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lexlohr profile image
Alex Lohr Author

I obviously am, but from that I've heard, Ukraine was planning a military action against the dissenters in Donbass, so the invasion might feel justified at least to Russians as certainly not unprovoked.

That being said, I'm still convinced the invasion is certainly a breach of international laws and not justified.

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theaccordance profile image
Joe Mainwaring

Military action within one’s own country is a domestic issue and there is insufficient evidence of actual genocide with open source intelligence, a third party intervening is not justified in this case.

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darkwiiplayer profile image
π’Š©Wii πŸ’–πŸ’›πŸ’šπŸ’™πŸ’œπŸ’πŸ’Ÿ

Exactly. Russia may have "felt" justified, but that just isn't relevant. It's the international equivalent of punching a random person on the street because you didn't like their face.

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olyno profile image
Olyno

You confuse the government and the population of a country a lot. Russia is in itself a dictatorship:

Definition of a dictatorship:

Concentration of all powers in the hands of an individual, an assembly, a party, a class.

Therefore, many people living in Russia did not choose to start this war. From what I see, you seem to be lumping all Russians into one camp.

Also, the fact that we do not take part in the war and the conflict does not mean that we choose the side of the aggressor and that we support his actions.

Definition of something neutral:

One who refrains from taking sides.

Inaction is the very principle of neutrality.

Finally, we are dealing here with a propaganda:

Definition of a propaganda:

Action exercised on the opinion to make it have and support certain ideas (especially political ones).

This is what Ukraine is doing lately, and especially what people all over the world are doing by specifying their sides and showing their support to Ukraine.

Again, I'm just being neutral, and I wish everyone else was. Unfortunately, I understand that empathy can distort one's view of a situation, and I am the first to be saddened by what is going on. I wouldn't want to experience what the Ukrainians go through every day, and I support their courage.

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darkwiiplayer profile image
π’Š©Wii πŸ’–πŸ’›πŸ’šπŸ’™πŸ’œπŸ’πŸ’Ÿ

I can only repeat that none of the things that make this a black-and-white issue where Russia is the only one at fault has anything to do with propaganda. Claiming so is, at best, painting a very skewed picture where Russia may have valid reasons for invading Ukraine. At worst it's actively undermining the truth and excusing war crimes.

Propaganda will always be used on both sides of any armed conflict. Pointing this out in this case is like watching someone get stabbed only to point out that they called the other guy a dumbass the day before. It's just surreal.

lexlohr profile image
Alex Lohr Author

In every war, every side subscribes to its own truth, so their reasons need not make sense to outsiders.

But as I stated initially: we don't know if a Russian will be pro- or anti-war.